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6. Gay men and FtMs
--Recently I've been hearing that more and more people in the US are undergoing hormone replacement. Is this true?
I think so - from about 5 years ago, or a little longer. It used to be that, in the States, you had to have permission from the government or a psychiatrist to get access to hormone therapy. Then, in order to start, you had to live as the other gender for a year. However, recently the hormones and treatment have become part of a privatized industry, meaning that the bottom line is, “If you want it, just do it. You don’t need approval.” Therefore - as with all things in the capitalist system - if there’s a demand for it and people will buy it, then there’s a market and people will provide it. As a result, the doctors are providing.
--What do you think about this?
I don’t know. I feel so many different ways about it. Mostly, I’m just really happy that people get to do what they want to do with their bodies. But also, as a feminist, I can’t help but wonder about the implications for us all. What is it to be a woman? To be a man? There are people who have taken on this struggle since the beginning of time - they do it by challenging what was expected of their gender - whether it was Joan of Arc or native Americans who would see themselves as “two spirited”. As a rule, people can always be swayed by popular opinion and, since we all want to fit in, I’m not always confident in the “truth” that we believe in as individuals when we make our own choices. I think all of that comes into play. But my friends who have gotten chest surgery and are taking testosterone or who are just taking testosterone and bind themselves, they seem like they’re happy. I don’t have any friends who say they regret it and I think everyone should be free to choose to do what they want. Yet, as a culture I think it’s important to really think about what is going on whenever there’s a mass move towards something - to wonder what is motivating it.
I mean, it’s not like I’ve never thought of it. I did when I was younger. But I was raised by really radical parents who think it’s more fun to just be rebellious and not fit in to any category. Still, I think it’s great that this path is making its way into mainstream culture and giving everyone the chance to question all these ideas - these laws about gender and what’s expected of you. I hope it turns everything upside-down so that you can just be anywhere on the spectrum, and just be safe. We’ll see.
--It’s often said that America is about 30 years ahead of Japan in terms of human rights issues for sexual minorities - the lesbian baby boom is a good example of that. It's always so compelling for me to hear what is going on in the States at any given time.
That’s interesting. At times we’ve been at the forefront of gay rights here in the States but we still don’t have marriage. In that respect, more European countries put themselves in the lead.
※From Season 3 of The L Word. From left: Jenny (Mia Kirschner), Billy (Alan Cummings), Max (Daniela Sea).
--Getting back to The L Word, your character Max is FtM and I think, after his transitioning became apparent, many viewers expected him to continue dating women. However, in Season 3 he has a sex scene with a gay male character, Billy, and in Season 5 he is involved with another gay male character, Tom. I thought the story was really interesting. And then, just recently, I had an interview with a gay man who was himself involved with a transgendered man. It seems like this may be something of a trend now - the fact that the borderlines are dissolving and the grey areas are expanding.
I also thought the storyline was great. I have many friends who have become men, or realized that they are men, and a fair amount of them have come out as gay men. Either they’re dating men who are biologically male-born men or, more often, they’re dating other trans-men. This introduces questions like, “Are we gay because we want to be with the same gender or would we be with women no matter what.” It’s interesting.
--In other words, does one's lesbian identity mean that one is attracted to partners of the same sex, or that one is attracted to women? If a lesbian becomes a man, will that woman continue to be attracted to people of the same sex - meaning men this time, or continue being attracted to women. It's really a fascinating puzzle. Also, in Japan we hear quite often about how hard it is for many people to categorize, or label, lesbians when they are with FtM partners. As if dating a transgendered man would make you straight.
Some lesbian friends of mine who date trans-men talk about how they are made to feel invisible in a way. Often they are treated like they are no longer queer. But they are queer. For them, too, it’s odd to suddenly pass as straight. It’s a dilemma for them.
One element to Max's story in The L Word that I particularly like is the framing for his relationship with men and himself. He had always liked both boys and girls, but before his transition he was always only with women because he couldn’t stand being sexual as a woman - with a woman’s body. In essence, both Billy and Tom - these men - really make him feel like a man.
--How great. You know, your scene with Billy is one of my favorites! How was it to actually perform in it?
We had a lot of fun. I’ve known Alan since I lived in New York and he’s a good friend. Frank Pierson, who wrote the 1970s Hollywood film "Dog Day Afternoon", was our director for that episode - and we felt intimidated. Usually we have women directors for the program but, for once, we had this straight, older, and reputable male director - and we’re supposed to do this intense sex scene! But, you know, he was so great with it, and Alan and I really broke it down. We knew we should definitely be having safe sex and, you know, I surprised him by picking him up and carrying him over to the bar. It was a good day for working. We laughed a lot.
--Incidentally, I interviewed Parisa Parnian of Rigged/OUTfitters a while back and she mentioned that was her favorite scene as well. On another note, which actress on the set are you closest to?
In all honesty, the set is actually more a work environment than it is a “friend” environment. In that sense too though, I get along well with everybody. But if I had to pick I’d say definitely Marlee Matlin (Jody) and Pam Grier (Kit). And also Rachel Shelley (Helena). She’s a sweetheart and such a great person. I’d be hanging out with them.
--Which is your favorite episode?
In general, I liked showing Max at work. It was fun for me as an actor. I also really liked working on the Max and Jenny road trip out west. It felt real cinematic cause we got to do a lot of the work on location outside. Oh, and do you know the gay bashing scene? With the guys in the parking lot? That was one of my favorites.
--That WAS great! Jenny slams them with her, “We’re not fags, we’re dykes, asshole!” That line was so great that I got goose bumps when I first heard it (laughs). Is there anything you can tell us about the final season, Season 6, which should start running next January?
I don’t know anything yet but I’ve gotten hints. It seems we’ll be exploring Max’s story more, in some different way.
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